Freeconomy Blog
Sun
27 Jun
My new rule
| 62 comments |
I've made myself a new rule. If six and a half billion people can't do it, neither shall I. For if that isn't my rule, then the message I am subconsciously giving out is one - or all - of the following three options: a.) I, Mark Boyle, want to retain a lifestyle that is unsustainable in the truest sense of the word b.) I want to use more of the earth's resources than the rest of the world's people (on average) can, or c.) I want 67% of the world's population to die, so that those that remain - which I hope includes me - can have their share instead.
It's based on a simple fact. If everyone in the world wanted the current lifestyle of the average person in the UK, then it would take just over three planets to support that. Given that population is set to increase by a third, all of whom will want our Western lifestyle (as seen through the lens of Friends and Sex in the City, not the real day-to-day life here which really isn't something to strive for, as we all know), we can change it's name now to 'Four Planet Syndrome'.
So I now say to myself, 'If 6.5 billion can't be financially wealthy, then neither shall I'. You may argue that it is possible for all to be financially very well off, if only wealth was shared equally. But this is flawed thinking and not rooted in reality. If everyone was rich, who do you think would get up every Monday morning and spend 40+ hrs of their week in a factory creating the little parts that go to make our gadgetry and machinery? (if you are about to say machines, then who will work in the factories to make these machines and then repair them?) Yet it is this relentless pursuit of more and more gadgetry, more stuff, that drives the economy, creates money through debt and increases financial wealth and GDP.
This is one of the reasons the class system was designed and constructed, and why it still exists in a time of abundance. It is one of the reasons we maintain inequality. If there isn't a working class, who will work in the tinned bean factory, or the oil rig? You?
If you had a fantastic education, and lots of money (without the inflation that would inevitably come with us all being financially wealthy), would you be happy to work in the ready meal processing plant? The point about inflation is also crucial - it really hammers home why it is impossible for us all to be financially rich at the same time, as the effect on inflation would mean the rich were no longer rich, as everything they wanted to buy would cost so much more, reducing the worth of their cash. Being financially rich requires some majority (i.e. the working classes) to be financially poor.
If humanity went moneyless, people would stop doing all the jobs they find meaningless and monotonous (without the reward of cash, who would bother doing most of the jobs this wage economy has forced them into?), and engage in crafts that added something beautiful to their communities. For more on this concept, please read either William Morris's News from Nowhere, Thomas More's Utopia, or Kahlil Gibran's The Prophet.
Where do you think the profit - which makes us seem 'wealthy' - comes from? Thin air? It either comes from someone else's loss, from the abuse of animals or other humans, or from the Earth's natural capital. Today we have made the crucial mistake that no responsible business person would make: selling our assets and then calling it income!
This is like a retail manager selling his/her cash register and shelving units, not replacing them, and then absurdly calling it income, by sticking it in the profit and loss account to show their shareholders a better bottom line for the year. Our world leaders do this with Planet Earth PLC, that massive retail outlet. The bottom line on the P&L account looks great for the shareholders (read 'the voters'), but has any voter taken a second to bother to look at Planet Earth PLC's Balance Sheet. (for more on this, see the first chapter of the book, The Moneyless Man). It looks terrible - we lose between $1.5 and $5 trillion in natural capital from deforestation alone each year. How much do we lose from oil, not to mention all the other minerals and materials were mining? Nature crunch makes the measly $1.5 trillion we lost in the credit crunch look almost irrelevant.
If 6.5 billion people can't shower twice a day, machine wash their clothes three times a week, and flush their toilet ten times a day (because that would be catastrophic for the world's fresh water supply), neither shall I.
If 6.5 billion can't drive to work everyday, because of the effects on the earth's reserves, the climate and pollution levels, then neither shall I.
If 6.5 billion, and their future children, can't have food shipped all over the world in little plastic packets, because oil is not an infinite resource and will, by definition, run out eventually, then neither shall I.
And the list goes on.
What does the word sustainable mean to you? Energy efficient light-bulbs? Or something deeper? Today we cling, like addicts, to lifestyles that are not possible for all, and attack those who point out this simple truth (like the alcoholic who attacks the friend who tells him/her that the booze is going to kill them unless they give it up soon).
How does one define greed? Is it just bankers and Wall St. who are guilty of it, or are we all taking more than we need or that the earth can sustain? Some say change is not needed, that everything is OK, but they are not those who continue to suffer unbearably in debt-ridden and war-torn countries because we want more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more.
Four per cent growth in GDP, year-on-year, on a finite planet. Doesn't add up, does it? Many now argue for a zero growth economy, which would be an astronomical paradigm shift, and very positive. Yet this would still not be enough, as it operates under the fantasy that even maintaining the current level of production, with no more growth, is sustainable. It's not. We really need to understand this simple fact and stop living in the fantasy we've been sold. Just because the truth is difficult, it doesn't mean we can get away without facing it. We're living on a timebomb, one which can be deactivated at any point before it goes off.
It is time for us all to lift our heads out of the sand, face up to reality, and embrace it. It's not a sacrifice. The new world we want to create is a solution to the ills of this one. Let's do our very best to end our addictions to a world that is inherently destructive and unsustainable, and pioneer this future society, individually and collectively, one of us at a time. It's just an addiction, it's not real. Break the habit and liberate yourself from it's control over your mind.
Great to be sharing the planet with you all.
THE FREECONOMY BLOG is written by Mark Boyle, who has been living for 19 months without money, and is the founder of the Freeconomy Community. He is the author of The Moneyless Man.
Comment on this Post:
Roger Bradley comments ...
How amazing to dare to be different Mark - BRILLIANT.
I differ with some of your opinions though;
Money came about to make life easier - we don't have to spend our lives bartering for what we need. Greed has taken over though and now making money has become the aim which is wrong.
To have a sustainable population of around 1 billion people is absolutely vital. Not so that that population can consume all that they wish but so that the planet can survive. Sooner or later a limit has to be set for unchecked population will lead to fights over that essential requirement, water. And that's ignoring living space and food!
As a species we should look to changing our attitudes; sharing, not greed; caring, not self indulgence; responsibility, not control.
Inequality is not something that is maintained for the benefit of exploiters. It is a positive asset. We are all different (unequal) but in that inequality we bring our own special unique talents to the magical melting pot that is humankind. Without diversity there is stagnation and decay.
I guess we are saying pretty much the same thing though so best of luck with all you are doing.
Roger.
Des Troy comments ...
The future lies not in the minefield of competition, but in the garden of collaboration.
CFB483 comments ...
I had a realization in 1988, when I was an economics major at university, that the rich create the poor. There was no getting around that idea for me, so I dropped economics like a stinking turd.
The economists know this, and they also know that the money supply (resources) are limited which is why they had to create debt to A) keep the economy growing and B) to create a new opium for the masses. You see, with a finite money supply, the rich cannot get richer if the poor get poorer. It leads to an unrest that disturbs the system.
The realization also forced me to live on much less, about $1000 U.S. dollars a month. And I am working on my conditioning to be in a space where I can live without it at all.
So, after saying all that, I love the question you apply to your actions, and it is in my head as well now.
Also, if you have the time and power on the internet, look up the Hadza tribe of Africa. To me they are essentially the ideal of human sustainability.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadza_people
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ Just one more house rule from now on:
Anyone posting under a different name than their real name (or the name they commonly use here) or pretending to be someone else to promote their work, will have their post deleted. Sorry but its not acceptable. Had a fairly shameful example of it today (LG/KH), if you're coming on here to promote your work then at least be up front about it, or at least use different style language each time you do it (under a different name) to make it less obvious!
CFB483 comments ...
@Mark Boyle, Just curious, what happened to your response to my post?
Ember Love comments ...
in a world where psychopaths are rewarded for being greedy and the general public are so lacking in qualitative discernment as to allow the billions of starving, desperate people on the planet to go without the 'basic human rights' they take for granted every day, how can we expect change to come from anywhere other than our own realisations of 'Reality As It Is'?
it is hope that drives us to spread the information and compassion that stops us going insane, but as you say Mark: the 'Everything will be OK' chant is just that.. a mantra of denial.
thanks for the inspiration, it is helpful to know that the community is awakening :)
js comments ...
Hi,
Just finished your book "Moneyless Man" which I really enjoyed and take my hat off to you for the way you made it work. Just to put my two pennyworth in, I have had times in my life where I had, what to many people would think was, "it all", very well paid job, own home, top of the range car etc. and other times when I had much less of everything. The having a lot times made me feel like I had done what was "expected of me", I had "made it" but yet left me feeling rather empty with a "what now" question because I wasn't genuinely enjoying it. It hadn't made me happy and really brought home that no matter how many times you can say to folks "money doesn't make you happy" they will still reply that "that's easy for you to say cos you have it all" and there will always be folks with that perspective. But, it's almost as if you have to "get there" to realise just how empty a place "it" can be. I guess what I'm suggesting, for those who can't see a way of transition between the world now and the one you spent your last year in, is that, if you look around at the numbers of people (often "high fliers") with mental illness, depression, and others who are currently wealthy but just miserable, there does seem to be an almost spiritual groundswell of folks who want a better way cos they sure ain't happy now! If these numbers swell to a sufficient "tipping point" then more will voluntarily engineer themselves a more stress free, simpler existence because they just can't cope with the world we have now. I have no doubt there are many readers of this blog who will disagree with me that this wouldn't happen because there won't be enough people or that it wouldn't happen quickly enough for this to work but if we continue using the resources of fuel and water at the rate we are now there will be riots in the streets and civil disturbance - something will give sooner rather than later. I hope it's because of the tipping point of people's consciousness rather than the riot route. One other thought to conjure with, you know when you have a good clear out of your home/wardrobe/office, whatever, why is it that you get such an uplifting feeling? Could it be that subconsciously we know our lives are just full of junk we don't need?
Madeleine comments ...
Roger Bradley - it is not Greed as we know it that creates money problems, it is our inclination to Convenience (which begets greed). The sheer convenience of 'not having to spend our lives bartering' or tending our own gardens or building our own resources is what has channeled modern man into a sucking vortex of energy depletion.
Energy is an exchange, and when we can get away expending as little energy as possible in our every day lives, the energetic cost of what we gain comes from somewhere else. While it might look like a bank note to us, it stands for poverty and environmental destruction elsewhere.
Clare Josa comments ...
This post contains such a simple message, yet is so powerful.
It hit me like a bucket of cold water on a Monday morning.
Off to do some serious soul-searching, to see how my family & I can make shifts in our thinking and actions to move closer to that profound new rule.
Woo. Thought we were doing well with being green, but it's still so far from being truly sustainable.
Thank you for the wake up call, Mark.
Namaste,
Clare
Anthony comments ...
thanks madeleine but it was either you or me who told him (Roger) - and you put it better than I would.
Thanks.
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ Katharine - I'd have absolutely no problems shaking hands with you (I'd prefer a hug to be honest though), but please don't insult my already limited intelligence, I assume then this lady named Lydia was posting in the past as 'Cath' then?
If you can forward the email Lydia sent to you telling you of this last night (or be upfront) I'll reinstate your last post and apologise completely. My email address is in 'contact us'.
All that aside, if you ever want to have a public debate on the subject, I'd be very happy to. I think debates are a fantastic tool to better understanding. Paper accepts all ink, and most of what is written these days - especially about money and true sustainability - is founded on complete lack of understanding. Maybe I'm completely deluded, it is very possible, but if I am then a public debate (filmed) would make me look the fool I probably am.
Much respect either way.
Katharine Hibbert comments ...
Hi Mark
I have no idea whether "Lydia" is the same as "Cath" - and I haven't seen posts from the latter, perhaps because they're deleted. But I can tell you for sure that I am neither, so I repeat that it wasn't "my" last post! Some people call me Kath, and you are welcome to, but it's spelt with a "K"!
I got the message on facebook so I don't have an email I can forward you and in any case I don't think that would be the right thing to do - it was sent to me personally. I will reply to her to ask her to email you or facebook you herself if she wants.
I don't mind whether you reinstate her post or not, whatever it said, so I'll leave that to her. I hope we do meet sooner or later - for that hug or handshake as much as for the debate. I would be very interested to talk to you, casually or publically, since we seem to have the same aims (a happy, sustainable world) but different beliefs about how to get there. And I totally agree that debating this kind of thing is a good way of moving both people's sides in the argument forwards. People often ask me about your project when I do my own book readings etc, so I'd be glad to meet you in person.
I do find it interesting how, when people are dealing with similar territory, where they disagree really stands out. I don't imagine that you and, for instance Matt Ridley would have very much to talk about since you come at things with such different attitudes. But when I had the luck to meet Tristram Stuart (who has written a great book about food waste), we found loads of things to argue about. I hope I have the chance to have the same experience with you sometime. And I think it's important to remember what we have in common.
Kath
Katharine Hibbert comments ...
Oh - I see you did mean "my" last post, since you've deleted it - I hadn't noticed when I posted my more recent one. So feel free to delete this one too, if you'd prefer to do this by email, though I'm not sure there's much more to be said.
Seamus Bradley comments ...
Fair play Mark. Another great post. Reading the book here at the minute. It's good stuff.
Of course, people are in different positions from the outset and influences are important determinants on action. This site is a great source of positive influence, away from a monotonous consumer culture where enough is never enough.
Keep up the good work everyone.
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ Katharine - no problem, but I searched for her on Facebook but no sign (or you actually), so feel free to add me as a friends and as I say, if I was wrong I'll apologise unreservedly.
I agree about people in this movement focusing on differences instead of commonalities. I personally support anyone who is out there trying to make a positive impact on a troubled world, even if I don't agree with everything they speak about. But then I am only responding to you right now, I've never been critical of anything you've said in the past, because overall I admire that you're trying to make a positive difference. I don't want to be anti-anything else, I don't have time, I'm simply making an offering.
But if someone is critical of the philosophy that guides actions these days, and I feel that the criticism comes from a very limited understanding, then I'll debate it with them.
So the offer of a public debate, filmed, still holds if you want to do it, and if I realise my understanding is wrong I'll be the first to put my hand up and change my views on it.
Katharine Hibbert comments ...
@Mark - Thanks for this response. I'm on facebook as Kath Hibbert, and there's a page for my book too. The Lydia who contacted me about is on too. I had trouble finding you as Mark Boyle or your book on there just now, so perhaps the search doesn't work very well.
Definitely let's have the public filmed debate - I'd enjoy it. What would you suggest as the motion?
@Bob thanks very much for your interest, and for the open invitation. Much appreciated. I'd enjoy debating with you, too, so perhaps we can find a motion and a time and a place that works for all of us.
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ Robert Howes - yes I deleted it for the reasons I stated earlier, for promoting work pretending to be someone else. Kath / Lydia can prove me wrong at any moment by getting in touch on facebook and I'm happy to reinstate the links if that simple request is met.
I deleted yours for repeat posting, both the actual post and your email address. Until you verify the details of what you're doing up there (in a blogpost as I offered to you), I won't be allowing your email address anymore. It is still available as a comment on a previous blog for anyone interested, as that was genuinely from you and not a repeat post.
Against lots of advice, I didn't moderate this blog for over two years, but you get to the point where enough is enough and I admit I was wrong - blogs do need moderation. And I've had enough to be frank. None will be happier than I if I can stop moderating this as its just another drain on time, but that's up to people respecting the two really fair rules I've asked to be respected.
Robert Howes (Llansamlet, Swansea, Wales, UK) comments ...
@ Mark,
kath has kindly agreed to a debate sometime:
"@Bob thanks very much for your interest, and for the open invitation. Much appreciated. I'd enjoy debating with you, too, so perhaps we can find a motion and a time and a place that works for all of us."
How about you, Mark?
***
I have visited Kath's Facebook page and notice that we have one friend in common, you, Mark.
***
So I clicked the friend request and sent Kath a message. I hope she accepts.
***
I think you and Kath and I should do a three way email or IM conference long before anything video recorded.
Cheers,
Bob
***
Thomas comments ...
Hi Dude, I'd like to say thank you caus' now I realised I could live the same happy life by taking only what I need, not more. I knew it, we all know the answers to our questions, but sometimes it takes to have someone else example to make it a reality. That one was you, and your message/action/initiative has definitely some impact on the peoples. Glad to see peoples like you exist in this world. All the best. Thomas
jason palmer comments ...
have you seen this ?
THE DIVISION OF LABOUR
We have much studied and much perfected, of late, the great civilized invention of the division of labour; only we give it a false name.
It is not truly speaking, the labour that is divided; but the men:- Divided into mere segments of men - broken into small fragments and crumbs of
life; so that all the little piece of intelligence that is left in a man is not enough to make a pin, or a nail, but exhausts itself in making the
point of a pin or the head of a nail.
Now it is a good and desiriable thing, truly, to make many pins in a day; but if we could only see with what crystal sand their points were polished,
- sand of human soul, much to be magnified before it can be discerned for what it is - we should think there might be some loss in it also.
And the great cry that rises from all our manufacturing cities, louder than their furnace blast, is all in very deed for this, -
that we manufacture everything there except men; we blanch cotton and strengthen steel, and refine sugar, and shape pottery; but to
brighten, to strengthen, to refine, or to form a single living spirit, never enters into our estimate of advantages.
John Ruskin, The Stones of Venice
CFB483 comments ...
@Mark Boyle
The comments section is making my head spin. You had a comment right after one of my posts about people posting under repeat names. Was that directed at me?
You also had a nice response to my comment which you deleted, and was wondering why?
If you think I am someone who has posted here before I can assure you I have not.
Please respond @CFB483 because I think you think I am someone else. I can send you an email as well.
Trish Young comments ...
@ Jason
Lovely quote from John Ruskin, particularly that last paragraph. Each life important !
Thanks !
@Mark, love the Planet Earth PLC description !
Our lovely earth !
jason palmer comments ...
species tend to grow in number until they hit a natural barrier, global warming may kill billions of people and thus reduce human pollution by reducing people ?
Have you read the ideas of James Lovelock ?
Your right about capitalism being insane, I think it was Alan Greenspan who said that failure to take into account the damage to natural resources was a sign of 'massive market failure'.
Karl Marx wrote about how capitalism forces people to act in a way that is not natural, but becoming slaves to capital.
The sad truth is that if you pitch people against each other, in a capitalist system, then, those best adapted to it will spread their genes.
I like to take the 'long long view' and see humans as just one species, of many, to have lived on this one planet, of many.
I suspect humans are just smart enough to invent lots of things but not accept the limits of our planetary resources.
BUT ... I could be wrong, solutions may be found ?
Trish Young comments ...
@Mark
that should have read " our lovely earth, so much ill treated !"
Mark Boyle comments ...
@CFB483 - apologies at not getting back quicker! No I don't doubt you are who you are for a second, and I responded initially to say that I found your post refreshing and that I agreed, the more you understand money and Western economics the more insane it gets.
The reason I deleted it just after posting was because I felt I went on a bit of an unfair rant after that, which had a tone of negativity that wasn't going to serve any positive purpose, so I deleted it and stayed silent until I contemplate more about how I feel first. So nothing to do with you, I admired what you said!
@ Jason Palmer - Ruskin, now there was a man who understood. I often wonder why so much mediocrity is read these days when greats such as Ruskin, Gandhi, Thoreau, Emerson and others of such level of understanding go largely unread.
@ Trish - yes I agree, Nature Crunch is one of the least debate major issues of our time, and one even the environmental movement doesn't want to think about. Respect to the likes of George Monbiot for being human enough to be the messenger of bad news.
Jason Palmer comments ...
mark,,,,look what I found
http://home.snafu.de/mkgandhi/eng/exhibitions.htm
John Ruskin - "Unto This Last"
Reflections on Justice and Peace (2010)
Henry David Thoreau - "Civil Disobedience"
Reflections against Slavery and War (2009)
Martin Luther King - "I HAVE A DREAM"
Reflections on Nonviolence (2009)
Leo Nikolajevic Tolstoy: "I Cannot Be Silent!"
Reflections against Violence and War (2008)
Gandhi's Path to Nonviolence
Autobiographical quotes, photos, original voice (2008)
Established in 1990 the GANDHI INFORMATION CENTER has been freely available for Education and Culture. It has more than a hundred members at home and abroad, amongst them well-known scientists, artists and authors such as the Nobel Peace Prize winner Adolfo Perez Esquivel, Count Serge Tolstoy (1911-1995) and Professor Joseph Needham (1901-1995).
Melanie Frances Mary John comments ...
@Bob and all
Thanks for your messages.
Bob youre questions are highly relevant and I am in the process of setting up a new website which will allow discusion of your exact points I believe- I will not answer them here tho as I feel it needs a whole new site and I will not divide my time. However when the website is done I will invite you to join it. In the mean time yes I agree you need to read a bit more about economics the Paul grignon films are a goodstart or the book Money Understanding and creating alternatives to legal tender by Greco. Also check the AMI american monetary institute you may find these intersting and offering you a valid arguement against what you seem to believe that the only problem with money is the need to spend it into existence. As I say I will not discuss this further on this web blog but please read these books and sites to give yourself a basis so that you can engage well on the new page. I will send a message here when I have set the page up. Cheers mel
Steve comments ...
Hi Mark
Hope all's well.
I think that once the Government start paying off the banking systems multi trillion pound casino debt via taxation, the type of rampant materialism we've been seeing during the last few decades will thankfully subside with the scarcity that this type of extraction will bring.
For all of the so called Enlightenment ideas and proliferation of rational thought in the West and we have ended up with a scenario of from abundance to scarcity in little over a century, threatening our own and every other living organisms existence for the sake of convenience, status, ownership and a whole host of other ills sold to us by Free Market capitalism's snake oil salesmen.
Frida comments ...
It's not easy but there's definitely a lot that can be done. Everybody's situation is different. I lately have the criteria "can I do without this", rather then "do I need it". Theorising isn't my thing and living without money is not possible in my situation, having two young teenage daughters. But learning to think different and use the environment in stead of misusing it...spending less and differently is a process of learning I'm happy to step into. Even after some 'rich' years, living like I do now is much more rewarding. Allthough the reason I got into it wasn't that much fun. Since I noticed your info and this website I see much more...so much is thrown away, badly used. little appreciated etc. But in the west of the Netherlands where I live it's not easy to make a turn to an alternative lifestyle. Anyway...we're learning and I appreciate your sharing Mark. It's inspiring, it sure is.
mobile comments ...
I just find it difficult to use less money, as a high school student in china.everyone around me thinks that is silly.actually i really do not know what can i do? I whish could be a moneyless guy like mark ,he looks so great.
Mark Boyle comments ...
This week's Freeconomy blog on the Guardian is called 'Stuff for Free', where I outline ways in which you can save lots of money, seriously reduce your ecological impact, and get creative in the process all at the same time. You can check it out at:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/blog/2010/jun/29/moneyless-man-cash-gather-posessions
LyssaM comments ...
@Mark... I have to say I was a bit dissapointed with the "stuff for free" blog post... I read it and was thinking "is that it?" It was a bit short and so many people already know about freegle and freecycle... I was kinda hoping to learn something new today! :(
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ All - I want to offer a complete apology to Katharine Hibbert regarding earlier comments, I was totally wrong. Genuinely sorry Katharine. I was pretty exhausted at the start of the week and reached my tolerance level of people abusing this blog in various ways for a couple of years, and you wrongly received the brunt of it.
@ LyssaM - Sorry for disappointing you. The Guardian limit you to about 800 words though. It's called a taster. If you want to know the rest, it's in the book, ask in your local library for it if you don't want to buy it. Had you heard of any of the other websites or ideas in it though? And can you appreciate that over 97% of people still aren't aware (and certainly haven't joined) any of the projects, and also don't practice any of the other points. If I go too extreme with the tips I'm called a idealist and get criticised for that too - see my problem?
Sean comments ...
I have to disagree Mark, wealth is not a zero sum game. It is a fact - wealth creation does not come from just stealing from the poor and raping the environment. That view is entirely too simple and pessimistic. Two good resources to counter this point are www.gapminder.org which is a graph showing the improving wealth and health of nations worldwide and the book The Origin of Wealth, which will clarify how wealth is created.
As for population growth - as societies grow wealthier their women become more educated and have less children, slowing the pace of population growth. Eventually this number will dip below two children per woman (as it has already done in parts of Europe) and we will see population decline.
As for a zero-growth economy... that just doesn't make sense. I would point you back to the Origin of Wealth. I don't know who is advocating that point of view, but it is certainly not economists. I'm sure you will counter that traditionally trained economists should not be dictating the future of our economies, but thats like saying doctors shouldn't be the ones to practice medicine.
Robert Howes (Llansamlet, Swansea, Wales, UK) comments ...
@ Mark, and everyone,
You really should watch this to understand about motivation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6XAPnuFjJc
Maybe you have seen it already and know how important it is.
Cheers,
Bob
***
Robert Howes (Llansamlet, Swansea, Wales, UK) comments ...
There are 246 videos in the series, including this one on super freakonomics, but my eyes are getting sore. See which ones you like and paste the links.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQItB5uoiHI&feature=channel
Cheers,
Bob
***
Maria Kirby comments ...
I like the gist of your rule, but exceptions keep coming to mind. I would expect a person living in the arctic to have a different kind of lifestyle than one living in the tropics. Or someone living in the desert from someone living in the swamps.
The idea of sustainability has both local geographic implications as well as global implications. We cannot be completely local without minimizing diversity through the island effect. Becoming totally global minimizes diversity as well to the most adaptable common factors -this is where invasive species comes in. Some how we need to strike the right balance.
I view the cost of labor issue not so much as an economic issue, but as a pride issue. I am not more valuable just because I can earn more. I should not waste more just because I can afford to. If we worried more about our integrity than our paycheck, life would become a lot more balanced all the way around.
Completeangel comments ...
Today I give up plastic packaging and will grow whatever I can to eat more healthily and do my bit for the planet - it's a start - join me
Robert Howes (Llansamlet, Swansea, Wales, UK) comments ...
Interesting read whilst nothing happening here:
http://www.helium.com/knowledge/6342-is-it-possible-to-live-without-money
Cheers,
Bob
***
Robert Howes (Llansamlet, Swansea, Wales, UK) comments ...
Mark has made it clear that he wants nothing more to do with me. It's his choice. I'm not staying where I'm not wanted. Goodbye everyone.
Cheers,
Bob
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Jorge Cabrita comments ...
I am atracted to a societywithout money,the jungle of ATMS,Banks,Credit Cards,Bridge and toll roads electronic gadjets to collect money from all.The world is becoming a jungle of electronic money grabbing devices,computerized stealing,stealing,empoverishing,arresting,debilitating.But have you really escaped from all this Mr.Mark Boyle.How is your book being paid?How is it being distributed and sold?We go and try out a new way,but are we destined to return to the old vomit?Can you escape,can we escape?
Vancouverite comments ...
Your blog is always challenging, Mark. I like that. Without being challenged, we get complacent.
Two things struck me. Firstly, I'm complacent and need to look more closely at what I consume.
Secondly, Americans and Canadians are always complaining that any governmental 'green' initiatives are going to force them 'to live like Europeans'. It's a mantra I hear all the time in public debate and from friends who purport to be 'green'. They mean the government wants them to turn off the heat when they go out of their homes, turn their thermostats down to 18C, use public transport, and have less toys like motor boats, ATVs, skidoos etc. So there you have it, to the N American continent, Europeans are poor and beyond that they can't imagine!
Sally Murray comments ...
Hi Mark.
I've just stumbled upon your site and work. Amazing good work! Thank you!
I'm at uni in Oxford and run a couple of speaker events there- one very cost and informal, one still friendly but more prestigious and large-scale. I think you'd be a fabulous inspiring speaker for students to hear. If you're interested, please let me know, ideally by dropping me an email. I'd love it if you could come and speak for us!
Many thanks and congratulations on your excellent site (and general approach to life!). Best wishes,
Sally
frantasia comments ...
@Mark
Mark,
Have you made it clear to Robert Howes that you want nothing more to do with him (ref. comment, above)?
I believe everyone's views are important and to be considered, and may spark debate for/against. Robert certainly brought out many interesting points and he is always engaging to read.
If it's true you've decided to no longer have Robert's posts on the blog comments, I would suggest that you reconsider.
Please answer this query, though, as it may be a misunderstanding (on my part, perhaps) and I would appreciate knowing for sure just what the situation is in regard to this - thanks.
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ frantasia -
Of course I haven't said that at all, Robert Howes is more than welcome to post here like everyone is. But he was never here for the benefit of what this movement was about, it was merely to recruit members for a project that I know nothing about, and that motivation formed the basis for almost all of his many posts on here.
I simply said that I personally wouldn't be joining whatever it is he was promoting, and that I wouldn't be promoting it either. That's a fairly basic human right.
I hope that clears it up, but its not something I want to spend any more time on to be honest. Thanks.
comments ...
@Mark
Mark,
It’s reassuring to know that your blog is open for comment by all. I certainly would hope Robert Howes, along with many others, will continue to post here and, should he do so, I look forward to reading more of his messages.
You wrote:
Of course I haven't said that at all, Robert Howes is more than welcome to post here
like everyone is. But he was never here for the benefit of what this movement
was about, it was merely to recruit members for a project that I know nothing
about, and that motivation formed the basis for almost all of his many posts on here.
-------
I wonder how you can so definitely pronounce on his motivation – unless he has told you privately, in which case I guess you could of course make a definite statement, which you’ve done.
To me, Robert Howes was always open with his opinions and ideas – he told us about the community he’s involved in and anyone was and is free to look up that website. He gave quite clear information on ideas and plans.
@Robert Howes
I hope you’ll be back commenting here – I’d quite look forward to seeing future posts from you.
05/07/10
mary comments ...
can six and a half billion people all write a bestseller book, especially if they don't believe in copyright, sell the translation rights, and then buy land with that money?
its not about no money, that is the symptom, not the cause.
its about the magic of living without fear, of knowing that there is always another solution, another way, everything we need in this world already exists, all we have to do is find it or make it ourselves. its the power of knowing how damn intelligent we are when we put our mind to it, each one of us, we can do anything, its the joy of being healthy, using our body, and breathing fresh air. when we are healthy then every move we make helps to heal and massage. its the beauty of being among the millions of colours and patterns and shapes, our senses and awareness heightened, its instinct. the power and magic of understanding ourselves how things work, because we feel it, see it, imagine it, dare to dream, and live. without any stupid emotions like embarrasment or fear or anger.
its about the absolute joy in growing your own food, being part of the cycles, that are so awesome and incredible, about fitting in with the rest, going with the flow, doing what feels right, every moment, and not being above, about feeling the universe, evey second of every day, of feeling the land under your feet and the heavens above.
this world has so much healing to be done, we each have to start with the tiniest of things, every little step we make gives us courage for the next, every little plant we plant gives us a pension for the future, every smile we smile makes another person smile.
love and strength to you all
Trish Young comments ...
@mary
Yay !
Such a wholly wonderful comment !
Lots of thanks.
frantasia comments ...
@Mary
I've just read your post - to me, it's a lovely, true message.
Good wishes.
frantasia comments ...
@Mary
I'd meant to add to the above that I feel your post is very much attuned to the spirit of this blog.
Martin comments ...
"If humanity went moneyless, people would stop doing all the jobs they find meaningless and monotonous (without the reward of cash, who would bother doing most of the jobs this wage economy has forced them into?), and engage in crafts that add"ed something beautiful to their communities.
The jobs you are referring to would still need to be done: these are the menial, municipal works that people do precisely because they get paid.
t
David Powell comments ...
Right behind low impact no cash society. Hate the waste and stupidity of supermarkets throwing away otherwise good edible food. Just one question can 6.5 billion people live as fregans?
Mark Boyle comments ...
@ Martin - how do you know which jobs would still need to be done, when I didn't even state which jobs I meant?
@ David Powell - 6.5 billion couldn't live as freegans, but they could live moneyless in my estimation. The difference between moneyless and freegan is huge.
Martin comments ...
"@ Martin - how do you know which jobs would still need to be done, when I didn't even state which jobs I meant?"
You did state which jobs: you said jobs that people find meaningless and monotonous.
Where there is society - communities of people - there will be certain common needs that must be met. Therefore there will still need municipal work to be done that many would find meaningless and monotonous. These jobs will still need to done. Who will maintain the infrastructure and administrate the needs of the community and the means by whcih they are addressed?
mary comments ...
independance - thats how we will all do the things that up till now we have found monotonous. things take on a different meaning when you are doing it for yourself and the ones you love around you, family, friends, community. grow your own food. plant everywhere, nothing should be left unturned. everyone should grow their own food, there is nothing like it -once you start-you can't go back. in your own backyard, garden, or even desrted plots of land nearby, parks, on the pavement outside in pots, dig up bricks and concrete if you like, on rooves, climbing up walls etc. its posible to grown everything ourselves - veges, herbs, fruits, grains etc. and its easier than you thought - one of the best ways to save the environment, in my belief, the only real way - no plastics, transport, factories, chemicals etc that goes into the mass production of food. it also saves on space, leaving more space for nature to grow untamed, biodiversity, trees will grow back, animals will come back, water will be absorbed in the earth again. we will never all be able to survive moneyless until we heal the world around us. we all need to start repairing the damage. we need to grow our own food, this is the key. we all want to be part of something great, some great radical revolution, and its here - permaculture, read about it, think about it, imagine it, and do it!!! no excuses. it really is this simple
afurka comments ...
Totally agree man
I'm only 16 and this is the first article I've read of yours after seeing you on Sunrise (in Australia) this morning, but I've been interested in escaping society and living off the land once I finish school. You are very much like Henry Thoreau and Christ Macandless and i recommend reading about them if you already havn't.
Anyways, just want to let you know that I respect what your doing and will be following your progress from now on.
Vlad Levin comments ...
I find this movement fascinating. However, as much as lowering our environmental footprint is important, is this way of living appropriate for the world at large or is it just a way of symbolically alerting people to the problems caused by over-development? After all, so many important technologies are driven by the capitalist model - medicine, communications, travel, education, etc. Is a non-capital based society the right answer? Or is it a matter of fine-tuning our capital-based society to deal with the problems of over-development while stimulating research into ways to solve these problems (advanced agriculture, alternative energy, better eating habits, etc).
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